After a bit of a break, I’m back with another online course creator interview! Jason Resnick of and I had a great conversation about the topic of today’s episode: interaction. It’s one simple word – but how do you handle interaction with the people who are on your email list, let alone enrolled in your course?

Be open to [your audience’s] ideas… Hear how these people want to learn, and then apply that to whatever you’re building.

Jason Resnick

It was great to chat about some of the similarities and differences between how Jason and I handle interaction. There’s a lot here to mull over, so put on your thinking cap and enjoy!

In This Episode, We Talked About:   

  • (2:22) How Jason aligned his course with prospective students
  • (3:05) What “interaction” means to Jason and how he implements it at different points along his funnel
  • (6:45) How and why he uses one of my favorite apps
  • (9:10) The reason behind Jason’s interaction-heavy approach
  • (10:22) The skepticism that we sometimes encounter when sending personalized messages
  • (13:34) Why and how Jason created his own online course
  • (20:12) Using a membership model
  • (22:26) What Jason’s course actually entails
  • (24:23) The pros and cons of different community platforms
  • (26:09) Why he chose to create a membership site instead of charging students a one-time fee
  • (28:20) The platform and plug-ins Jason uses for his course
  • (30:09) How Jason gets things done as a one-man show
  • (32:11) The ways that having an online course affect Jason’s life
  • (34:04) Jason’s advice for new course creators

Thanks for listening and learning along with me today. Stay tuned for another great episode coming soon!


Bonjoro Free Trial

Jason’s Website


Restrict Content Pro

Piano in 21 Days

The Online Course Guy

Jacques Hopkins: Regular people are taking their knowledge and content, packaging it up in an online course and they're making a living doing it. But not everyone is successful with all nine courses. There's a right way and there is a wrong way, and I'm here to help course creators actually succeed with online courses. Hi, I'm John Hopkins, and this is the online course show.

Hey everyone at jock Hopkins, and welcome to episode 95 of the online course show. The focus of today's episode is on interaction. So this means once someone signs up for your course, should you provide email support, live Q and a calls, should you have a forum or Facebook group and so on. But this also means what level of interaction should you have with your perspective students as well.

So people that haven't signed up for your course yet, but maybe are in your funnel somewhere along the way. And so to discuss all of this, I sat down with Jason Resnick of that's R E, Z, Z, and the feast online course, which is a course for freelance designers and developers, and Jason believes in a high level of interaction.

Even going as far as sending everyone that opts into his email list, a personal bungee Oro video, which is something you've heard me recommend you do. When the amount of email opt-ins you get each day is still manageable and speaking a bunch or that's exactly who has sponsored today's episode. At this point, I get about a hundred email optins a day myself and about three to five core signups.

So sending a personalized Bundoora video to all of my email opt-ins would be impossible. But I do send each and every person who signs up for my course, one of these videos, just welcoming them and thanking them for signing up for my course. And you should be doing this too, because it adds so much value to your student or prospective student.

And makes this process as easy as possible. So get started with a free 14 day trial by going to dot com slash that's dot com slash J a C Q. U. E. S. so with that, let's go ahead and jump over to this conversation with Jason right now in there. Jason, welcome to the online course show.

Jason Resnick: Hey, thanks for having me.

Jacques Hopkins: Yeah, it's my pleasure. So for people that aren't familiar with you and your work, tell us about your online course.

Jason Resnick: Sure. My online courses for developers and designers looking to build recurring revenue through specialization. It's a little unique in that I, instead of aligning myself with most online courses, I kind of align myself with a college or university or even high school even, where there's a lot of personalized guidance because not everybody comes in in the same place, but they know. That they want to specialize their business.

They know they want to build predictable income, but they're not really sure how to do it. So I try to meet them where they're at and be able to kind of build out a syllabus for them.

So I've heard about all, all kinds of different levels of interaction from no interaction, and it's completely, you know, on the student themselves to a lot.

Jacques Hopkins: So what does that mean specifically for you in your course? What does the interaction look like.

Jason Resnick: Yeah. So the interaction, basically it happens, uh, usually further up the chain. And I kind of take you a page from my, how I built my services business now, online coerce and coaching platform. That's kinda how I call it is, is that that came by accident.

I didn't set out to do that, but people were asking me how I built my web development business. Now I'm in New York, not a cheap place to live, obviously, but. People were like, how do you charge what you charge in the WordPress space on a monthly recurring basis? So after having many, many conversations with folks over the years, I was like, okay.

I mean, I could formalize this in some sort of way. Right. And you know, the interaction that I get is usually right from the time they opt into my list. I try to reach out to people via . Personalized video, 30 seconds or so, just thanking them for opting in and if they have any questions, feel free to reach out at any time.

And that little personalized touch kind of sets the tone right from the start is that I'm here to help in any way that I possibly can. Even if it's not me and I can refer you somewhere else, which there's many occasions that I do because I focus with the solo, mostly solo business owners or. Less than five people on their team.

If you're building a virtual agency, there are better people that know how to do that sort of thing. So I try to refer people over there, and so I start right there and then as they progress in, you know, listen to podcasts, mine download more resources, those sorts of things. It gets to a point where I, you know, my background as a developer and my services is more on the email automation and behavioral marketing side of things.

Kind of have key data points at which somebody indicates through their behavior that they may be a good fit. And so that's what, at what point I'll reach out to them, whether it's automatic or me just seeing the boxes sort of tick off, um, reach out and say, Hey, want to have a five minute, 15 minute conversation.

I think you might be a good fit for feast. If you haven't already thought about it. Maybe you have some questions. I'd love to be able to answer it. No strings attached sort of thing. And it is high touch. But what I've noticed is that people stay in, right? They, you know, because I'm there, they see that I'm there.

I'm not just throwing a Facebook ad out fam, getting them onto a webinar and then kind of handing them off to a team or something of that nature. It's more the people in the community, they're all kind of likeminded. They're all in a similar space. They're all looking to do the same thing. And so. As soon as they join, I schedule a call with them.

Now, not everybody takes me up on these things, but I've noticed those that do obviously stay on, but that initial call is really to try to build them a custom syllabus, if you will, based around the resources and the lessons, the monthly Roundup calls. These are sort of things that I basically build a syllabus out for them, and then I, I'm in a Slack channel with them. I have monthly calls with them. To be able to then help them in any sort of way that I can.

Jacques Hopkins: Jason, I have so many questions about, I'm fascinated by everything that you just said, so thank you for going through that so thoroughly and I want to get into it even more so right off the bat. Let's talk about Bon Juro.

You probably not aware of this, but I'm a huge fan. I promoted on the podcast. They actually, so the owner came on one of the episodes of the podcast and they sponsored the podcast for awhile. I love how you're doing that for email updates. So right now, for me personally, I just do it for, when people buy my course buy piano course, they'll get a bunch of aura from me and they, people love it.

I'm sure people love yours as well, but for people getting a manageable number of email subscribers per day, I do recommend they use a tool like Bon Jorda reach out. Give me an idea of like how many email subscribers you're getting per day, because that can become unmanageable pretty

Jason Resnick: quickly. Right? Yeah. So I mean, I get about less than five a day. And so, you know, for me it's manageable right now. And you know, I've talked to some other people too, and they're like, how do you do that? Like that's, and I just basically set aside time in the week to just kind of sit in front of a window and you know, 30 seconds and plow through in the mall kind of thing.

But yeah, I mean, at some point, if I do get enough in there, then I'm going to kind of have to move that initial handshake, if you will, further down the funnel. But until that point, why not do it now?

Jacques Hopkins: Do you recommend that pretty much anybody, like with an email list getting less than five or 10 email subscribers per day, do something like that?

Jason Resnick: Absolutely. I'm notoriously, I'm always trying things, experimenting with things, and so. The level at which a video can impact somebody is at a personal level rather is, is so, so off the charts that there's no reason not to do it. Right. I even did it on Instagram for two weeks. Anytime somebody followed me, then I would, because that's built in, right?

Like you could just DM somebody a personalized video. And so I wanted to see what level of engagement I could get from that. Even just a social platform that's public game's free and everything else. Well, I've had people come on the podcast for that. I've gone on their podcast for that all because of a 32nd video just thanking me to follow.

So if you're literally looking to. You know, widen your net, so to speak, or make a personal connection at a level that most aren't. Take some time and you know, either sign up to bone juror or come up with a creative way to, you know, make a video, right. And reach out and just say, thanks. That's all you really need to do. Where

Jacques Hopkins: do you draw the line between other things that you could be doing with your time and all this interaction that you are doing, and do you know, to add on to that, how do you have time for all this?

Jason Resnick: That's a great question. For me, I found that when I don't do that interaction, because I'm still doing services work, like that's the bread and butter, that's what keeps the roof over our heads inside.

Yup. When I don't do that interaction thing, the side of things, that's when things don't pan out as well. And you know, maybe people, I don't know, I don't want to say lose touch, but you know, they see it as, Oh, this is just every other opt in that I've got in, or this is every other course that I've bought or something of that nature.

And so I look at it as, Hey, if this is a recurring. Piece of leverage, part of my business, which it is. Then I need to look at that longterm. And if I build that relationship long term, it's only gonna pan off, pan out for everybody involved, you know, for the longterm. So I look at it basically as the revenue driver to the business.

Jacques Hopkins: That makes a lot of sense. Obviously the response you've gotten from is the personal emails has been very positive for, do you have any negative experiences at all with that

Jason Resnick: negative thing? I guess, and I don't know that it's negative, is that people they like, how did you automate this? The, the cynicism around that, even though I'm saying, you know, personally the person's name, what they downloaded, like all of the box, like there's no way that you can automate a 32nd video in that way.

Right. And so people will respond back, like, how did you automate this? What tool did you use? Like, you know, that there's that skepticism there, but that's like, I dunno, I would say, well, one in a hundred maybe one in 90 they get like that. But like. On the flip side of it is, is like people like, Holy cow, I've never got this before.

Like, this is awesome. Like, you know, I just downloaded an onboarding sequence from your website and you're sending me a 32nd clip thanking me that that's awesome. Like you almost instincts Lee, create a fan.

Jacques Hopkins: Yeah. And somebody just asking, Hey, how did you automate? This isn't even negative. It's just, um, yeah. I would almost say it's a positive cause then they're reopening this chain of communication. I know for me one time. I think it was the guy's name was like John, something very generic, and he was like, he replied to my bond Jorah and he was just like, I know that's automated. But thanks anyway. Or something like that.

And it, it struck me because it was an automated, I took the time to record that video for him. So ever since I got that message, like I've always tried to try to include one additional personal element into the video other than their first name, like calling out exactly which plan they signed up for, what date they signed up for it. Just so it just, cause. That that irks me that he thought it was automated when it absolutely was not.

Jason Resnick: Absolutely . What's funny is, is there's this YouTube ad that follows me every now and then, and my wife and I were sitting on the couch one day I hit on a YouTube link and this ad came up. And initially I thought it said, Hey, Jason.

And I was like, wait a second. Like, okay, that's ultra creepy. Like what the heck is that? So it was like I wanted to keep re triggering this ad somehow, right? Like, because I even said to my wife, I said, you hear that? She goes, yeah, what's wrong with that? I said, that was an ad. That said that not, it wasn't like anything that was sent to me and she goes, no, it is the way that they could do that.

And she does all the display ads and such like that. Like I was like, do you know what this is like? You know what I found out later was he said, Hey, I'm Jason. Like the host said, it's so quickly that it like grabbed my attention. I don't even know what it was for. It was for funnel building or something of that nature, but it was just like, I was like, Holy cow.

But yeah, I mean, people are strange when it comes to, especially in the tech world, and I, you know, I catered, I help, you know, developers and designers and they're in that space and that they're always, always looking for that next edge or that next thing or that shiny object when really it's just, Hey, it's old school and it's just, Hey, reaching out and saying thanks, or can I help you? Or, you know, anything of that nature.

Jacques Hopkins: Love it. All right, so you've got the ideal to make an online course or an online platform service to, to help teach people these things because people come asking you for it. Uh, give me an idea about the timeframe this was, and then what are the steps that you took to actually make it, cause I know for me personally, once I get the idea, I was overwhelmed by the steps to actually make it happen.

Jason Resnick: Absolutely. Once I got the idea, that was a long time for me to do this. Now I guess I thought of the idea of probably around 2014 to think about like, maybe I could start formalizing this in some sort of way, but I'm not sure how, I'm not sure what you know, and all of these other things and you know, like you overwhelmed and I kinda just back-burnered it because it just didn't have the brain, you know, availability to do something like that.

And so as I started, you know, I was making the podcast and I was doing these things. I was speaking at events and people, more and more people were asking the same question over and over again. And I'm like, I'm not a unicorn. Like if I could do it, then anybody else can do it. It's not rocket science. It's just you have to really get down into the work.

And so. I started looking back at my notebooks, things like, you know, what did I do? How did I, you know, come up with the ideas that I came up with to market myself and do sales. And so I started kind of like accumulating all of these things and what resources I can put together with it. And that was kind of like the start of the thing, but I didn't know, do I put this in a course?

Do I just put this as like a $200 product on my website? Like I didn't know how to figure out all the bits and pieces. And then it came down to Troy Dean, who he's now WP elevation is the founder of WP elevation, which is a great online course for WordPress consultants. And I was talking with him and I've known him for years, cause I come from the WordPress space and he'd said to me, he's like, why don't you just.

Put it in a course and have a community attached to that so that you can learn more from the community. And I said, yeah, it sounds easy, but how do you do that? Like, I don't know how to teach anything. I'm not a teacher. Like I don't how to make up a lesson plan. Cause that's kinda how I thought about it.

And he came out with this and it was, it was a course on building a course. And I don't think it's still around at this point, but. The framework that he laid out made total sense to me. Like I, it was just this like, Oh yeah, I can do that. And it was just like a six by six. There's basically six modules and six lessons in each module and figure out what the transformation between each lesson is and then the whole transformation when somebody goes through the course.

So that part I was like, okay, that's great. I can probably put something together. And I just started jotting down notes and created an Excel spreadsheet on this stuff. But then the other element came in where it's like, I don't want it to be something that is just there collecting digital dust on somebody's, you know, downloads or, or their computer or bookmarks or whatever.

And so I knew I was in other courses, other communities, and so I started to look at what I didn't like, what I did, like how I make, might do something that I sort of liked differently. And really just crafted this whole ecosystem, which I call feast, you know, which has a community aspect that has the coaching platform where I'm essentially handholding you.

Throughout the whole process. It has the resources as 70 plus videos on resources to download and do the things that you want to do if you want to do itself based. It was a lot of effort where I wasn't sure all of this stuff would work and so on. The advice of Troy, he said, why don't you just do a paid webinar, teach what you're going to teach and see if you could book the webinar.

I said, okay, I can do that. I throw up a landing page and I was, I figured what I was going to do is teach the first two modules of the course. If I could get 10 people in paying for that, just in my own audience, which was my Newt at that point in time is I wasn't catering to that group. I wasn't attracting those kinds of people.

If I could sell 10. Then I'm going to try to build this thing out based off of the back of that workshop, and it was a two day workshop where I basically ran through module one and module two and the workshop, I called it a workshop. It was really a webinar and each day was two hours. One hour was me going over the methodology, and then the other hour was the actual practice, the implementation, the work.

And so I got 11 people booked. And off of the back of that I got, you know, cause the way that I work is I'm all on data. And so I sent out questionnaires on at front and the back of the workshop, I took a look at all these things. I wanted to look at what the transformation was, what their expectation was, what they didn't like, what they did like.

And out of all of that, my whole sales page was built out cause I had gotten testimonials and all that other stuff. I didn't even think about that, but I was just like, Oh, this is a sales page. This is great. You know? But what it did was it validated the idea and it validated the idea in which people were willing to pay money.

And that for me was the Genesis of doing it. And that was 20 that was at the end of 20. 16 where I ran that workshop 2017 I was like, okay, let me try to build this course out, and I did that. I grandfathered all of these people in that, that essentially built the thing. I guess it was springtime 2017 is when I launched feast, but I didn't really put any effort into any marketing, any, any really into it.

Because I still had a lot of services work and I couldn't do that. So I just said, I'm going to dedicate a day a week to this, 20% in, and basically what I saw on a return for that was really powerful, that in 2018 I was just like, all right, let's, let's, let's make a run at this.

Jacques Hopkins: So let's, let's look at where it stands today. It's a, it's a membership, like a monthly membership fee today as opposed to a onetime fee. Right, right. What is the, what is the pricing?

Jason Resnick: It's $69 a month, or you could pay annually and get three months free.

Jacques Hopkins: Okay, so a ballpark active members right now?

Jason Resnick: A ballpark active? I would say about 45

Jacques Hopkins: ish. Okay. And uh, how long on average are you seeing people stick around?

Jason Resnick: I would about a year and a half.

Jacques Hopkins: That's impressive. Yeah, that's impressive.

Jason Resnick: Because, and I know, I would say the churn basically happens for those that have come in with unexpectedly high expectations of something that it's not like they basically turn out in the first month and if they don't, then they hang on.

And it's shocking too, because as I said, I, I, I try to communicate with people upfront and I've had people ask, Hey, is this going to get me clients? Well, if you need clients, you should actually go talk to them. Like, stop talking to me. Um, because that's where you're going to get the clients from. But I'll help you build the foundation to be able to get clients, market yourself, position yourself in the market that you're in.

All of those kinds of things, but if you're looking to get a client tomorrow and you need money, they don't pay money. Here I go spend time on the phone or email or reach out to other people and I would say about seven out of 10 times of having that conversation, the person joins and I'm like, why? Why? I just told you not to join.

And they join because they say, you are honest with me. And I wanted to see what was behind the curtain. And those people do turn out after that first month. Cause I know they're going to, I'm like, you're not going to find what you're looking for back here. But you know it's, it's, it's funny like how just even being a human being, I'm telling you know, like this isn't going to help it.

And then they still commit. And I'm like, do you want your money back because you're not going to get, I don't want to take your money if it's not going to be helpful to you cause it doesn't help me. It doesn't help you. And what's the point? And so, but those people that stay on after that month, they usually, they have for the long term

Jacques Hopkins: what is inside the membership site course. You mentioned Slack. What else is in there?

Jason Resnick: Every month we have a monthly Roundup call, which I facilitate. Basically, it's the community coming together on a zoom call like this, and, um, we, you know, I facilitate it, right? So a lot of times it's somebody comes there with an idea or a client situation and they want to bounce some things around.

They have a question asked, that kind of a thing. But I try to spark that conversation through a topic of the day, if you will. It's just an hour long conversation. But you know, at the top of 10 minutes sometimes, you know, you have to grease the wheel a little bit to get people to open up and talk. So that's what my job is really to be excluding.

Do that. But I also share wins in the community to a Slack. We have a whinge channel, so. Yeah. Every Friday post up what your wins are. And so I kind of go and I highlight some people, some members of the community that's doing great things and getting big wins, or even making small wins in their business where they're building processes, because that's what's going to lead them to bigger wins and things of that nature.

I also try to do quarterly checking calls. So like I said, when somebody joins the first week, I want to get them scheduled for a call so that. We learn a little bit more about where they are and meet them, but the quarterly call is really just a check in to say, Hey, how are you doing? You know, what problems are you having?

It's more of an education for me to be able to figure out what it is that I can do, if I can do anything to help them further. And then outside of that, it's, you know, just, it's really just the Slack group. People DM me from time to time in there. I allow them to book a 15 minute, I call it action. Take our call with me anytime they want, just as them as a member of the community, and it's surprisingly low.

How many people actually take advantage of that, but it's there if they want it.

Jacques Hopkins: The the most popular community kind of platform that I see people using with online courses would be just Facebook groups. Why did you decide to go with Slack instead of something like

Jason Resnick: that? Well, I had a Facebook group. And I, I actually had both.

I had Facebook and Slack. The thing with Facebook for me is one, I went with Facebook because of everybody else, but for two, it's everywhere. And like it's on your phone. It's on your desktop email. So if there's, you gotta get an alert about things. So I thought that that would help spark engagement. But the thing is, is.

When I want people to come to feast, I want them to come with the intent of work. Do the thing that you want to do. I don't want them to get distracted with their niece and nephews pictures or cat videos or whatever else is all over Facebook. So I just decided to close the Facebook group down and just use Slack.

And now my, you know, if he's members are developers and designers, they're using Slack anyway, so it's not like. That's an unknown thing for them. Now, granted, people don't use Slack. They don't sign into Slack unless it's for whatever reason, and that's fine too. I'm okay with that, but it's there if that's what people want to use.

Jacques Hopkins: Now that's, I love it. I, I pretty much just use Facebook today for business purposes, but to your point, it's really easy to get distracted once you're there by, uh, by other things. So I played around with Slack and it's got some really cool features and I like, um, I like that reason for. Staying over there, especially considering who your students are, like they probably already are using Slack.

I'm familiar with it, and it doesn't let them get easily distracted by other things. all right, so membership deciding to go with a membership fee, monthly fee versus maybe a onetime fee. Why did you go monthly? Membership

Jason Resnick: fee one was affordability for the students too. My services background and my clients that I've worked with over the years now, I've been doing service work for almost a decade in my business alone.

So those people that have done those lifetime one purchase things, it becomes almost an albatross where. They're not sure how to raise brakes. They not sure how to transition for things. How much do you give and you know, hold up the honor of that lifetime membership. What does lifetime mean? Does that mean my lifetime?

Or when do I like, what does that mean? Right. And so I was just like, I'm just gonna. I appreciate all of those like concerns and. Especially from my client's end and all that. I was just like, I don't want to deal with that. Like, I don't know. I want to make sure that they're getting value in the course at the point in which they are in.

I don't want them to, you think that, you know, now I'm going to bug them and then they're going to go stale. And then whatever I like. And I have, you know, let's say 200 stale people and only, you know, 50 active people in these 200 people signed out four or five years ago. Right. And so. What does that mean?

What does that do for the community? So I want to make sure that people that are in there getting the value that they want to get out of the course, the platform and all that, I want to make sure that it is added value. And if it's not, then subscriptions over.

Jacques Hopkins: I think it's very, very much a case by case basis.

And it sounds like doing the monthly membership is a really good fit for your business. I can tell you like with piano in 21 days. I could never do a monthly membership because people would be like, I thought I was supposed to learn in 21 days. Like, why do I have to pay month over month? So I do give for that business.

I give people like quote unquote lifetime access in case it takes them longer. But, um, it's, I think it varies greatly. So I, uh, that's why I wanted to ask you specifically about your membership site. The course itself is hosted on what platform?

Jason Resnick: WordPress.

Jacques Hopkins: WordPress. Which plugin are you using?

Jason Resnick: Restrict content pro actually.

Okay. I actually, and I'm a geek and I'm a developer and all that stuff, but I've just layered WooCommerce subscriptions in between that. So I had built out this platform on learn dash and all these other things to have a social element in it. Kind of like, you know, gamification and all these other things, and nobody was using it.

And I was like, why am I maintaining this? Platform that there's no use for it. So I just paired it back and I said, look, all I need is just gated content, and that's what people are there. People are in the community, they're doing, you know, in Slack for the community aspect of it. We're using zoom for the calls and all that stuff.

So it's really just the content that needs to be gated and protected. So I just paired it all back and just do it that way. I

Jacques Hopkins: don't know why. I was surprised when you first said that because you are, you do have a background in WordPress development, and so, uh, that, that does make a lot of sense. You know, a lot of people today are using things like teachable, you know, the, the kind of canned platforms. But it sounds like that's working

Jason Resnick: really well for you. Yeah. I wanted to use my own platform only because I wanted to tie in a lot of things that I couldn't get from those other platforms. Things like checking in from when the person last logged in. I wanted it to be able to spark certain emails when they hit a certain point, which they were in the course, or you know, if they got stuck on something or whatever.

I wanted it to be able to do these sort of things. To help nudge people along if they got stuck. Because if they don't complete the course, it's not good for anybody. It's not good for me. It's I could put them. So I want to make sure that, that that happens.

Jacques Hopkins: Do you have a team helping

Jason Resnick: you? Nope.

Jacques Hopkins: Just you? Huh?

Jason Resnick: How do you do

Jacques Hopkins: it all? I guess we kinda, we kind of went over that already, but like, you're doing all these things, man. You're doing the monthly calls, like you allow people to book 15 minutes with you. All the while you're still running your freelancing business, right? You have clients there. I mean, like you have a family. How do you do it all, Jason?

Jason Resnick: That's a lot of time management is really what it comes down to. Yeah. I have a family, a young family who we've, uh, we just had our second son, so he's two months old. So the lack of sleep is there. So by the time management has now, what I could get done in an hour is now more like a day.

But, uh. Yeah, I mean, a lot of it is time management. I've always been very disciplined in that, and so I review what I need to do Sunday mornings with a cup of coffee. I basically take a look at my past week, take a look at the upcoming week, plan out everything so that when I like today's Monday, I knew exactly what I needed to take off the boxes on Monday, hitting the ground, working as soon as I wake up in the morning.

Yeah. I knew this podcast was, you know, we were having this podcast. Now I, you know, I'm obviously certain clients have deliverables that have to do, so I am very diligent about what I allocate my time to because we're not going to get that back. And I don't really, I don't want to say that I don't go down those rabbit holes, but I, I tend not to go down those rabbit holes of.

Shiny objects and getting distracted off of the things that I really want to get off, really want to focus in on. So for me, if it's not in my calendar, it doesn't

Jacques Hopkins: get done well. Phone power to you, man. Um, that's, uh, I rely heavily on my team and I probably get lazy sometimes and don't work as hard as as what you just described, but that's awesome that it's working so well for you.

As far as the online course goes. I think one of the big questions that sometimes I failed to ask and should is like, what has it done for you? Like having an online course, you know, if you didn't make this decision two or three years ago to have that online course versus you did make the decision. What does having an online course mean to you and your life.

Jason Resnick: It's pretty simple. It allows me to help other velopers and designers achieve the goals that they want to achieve. Right. Because for me, you know, like I didn't set out to have my own business because I wanted more bosses. I wanted to work more, that kind of thing. I set out to have time freedom to do what I want.

I mean, that was early on. I recognize that, but when we were on the way home from the hospital with our first son. I turned to my wife on a citizen, now what do I do? And she was like, what do you mean? Like in her mind, I'm like, it was like, I don't know why I was thinking that way, but like, she just had a kid and I'm asking her, what do I do now?

Right? And she's like, what do you mean? And I said, well, I've reached the goal that I set out to do. Like I want a business. And so that I could be home to see the first steps and hear the first words. So. He's in the back now. What? Right. Like I've done what I've accomplished and she, she just left and she goes, I don't know, make more money.

But in reality, for me, it was like, that's the aha moment where I said, how can I help others have that moment with they now, you know, whether it's spending time with family, whether it's traveling, whether it's working with a specific passion project that they really, you know, can get behind and want to work on. Whatever that thing is for them. I want to help as many people get there as possible.

Jacques Hopkins: So for those that are just starting out in online courses, maybe they're back in your shoes when you just got your idea. What advice do you ever somebody just like that, just starting out,

Jason Resnick: talk to whoever you think is your ideal student, have conversations.

It has to start there because. What you think is the solution and what you think the language is. I mean, it goes back to what I said about the workshop that I ran. I had no idea what that sales page was going to look like, but off of the back of that workshop that I ran in, the conversations that I had with people.

I heard the words that they used, I heard, you know, how they felt about certain things, and all of that stuff matters because it's the transformation of the student, right? Where they're at today and where they want to get to. Right? So, you know, when you start college, the ultimate transformation is to get a good job at the end, right?

Like that's. That's the idea of college, right? So if you're running a course, whatever that course is, and whatever solution that you're providing to them, know what that is in their minds, not in your mind. And in, once you have those conversations, you're going to start to see like. Maybe I need to move this way a little bit, maybe to the right or to the left of where I'm headed and be open to their ideas.

What are they looking to? How they learn, right? They might learn, some people learn video. I'm much, I'm a very visual learner. Some people much rather read some people much rather just listen to audio, right? So hear how these people. Want to learn and then apply that to to whatever you're building.

Jacques Hopkins: Well, Jason, it's been a pleasure, man.

Congratulations on, on all the success with this. Uh, to wrap things up, why don't you let us know if there's anything else you want to share with the audience and where people can find you online.

Jason Resnick: Yeah. Um, at Rez on Twitter, that's R E, three Z's and online. You can find anything out there. And if you are a developer or designer, and you're. Looking to learn a little bit more about how to build a predictable income, confined a free opt in right there on the home

Jacques Hopkins: page. Excellent. Thanks Jason. Appreciate it.

Jason Resnick: Thanks.

Jacques Hopkins: All right. That's going to do it for this episode of the online course show. You can find all the detailed show notes and links from today's show by going to the online course, 95.

And if you're listening to this and are not part of the free Facebook community, then I want to personally invite you to join. It's a group, of course, creators and aspiring course creators all helping each other out. So if you don't just want to listen to me, but actually interact with me and others on this journey.

Then check out that free group by going to the online course and click on community right at the top, or just search for the online course community on Facebook. And one final note to everyone listening out there, if you've gotten anything out of this podcast and want to support the show, I'd appreciate you very much if you left a review.

On whatever platform that you're currently listening to. This on reviews help tremendously in getting others to find the show as well. And like I said, if you feel like giving back and supporting my efforts here, I'd sincerely appreciate a review of the show. So that's it, guys. Thanks for hanging out with me for another episode and I will be back soon with yet another episode of the online course show.